Does God want us to be zealous?

My little contribution to the ‘should Christians/atheists contribute to questions that aren’t addressed to them’ debate is as follows:

Sometimes the questioner is asking a theoretical question about something that interests them. That’s what el_ricardo_777 has done here and I think it’s approprate that we should all pitch in our opinions, whatever they are.

However sometimes the questioner is troubled and has a particular fear or even a danger in their lives. At that point I think that both Christians and atheists should be careful to respect and care for that person above their own personal views. I don’t like seeing questions like that turned into a free-for-all debate, because someone with a problem asked a question and sometimes isn’t finding it answered.

There can’t be a ban on free-for-all debate, but I think there are some questions where we need to read the original question and carefully answer that, rather than begin to argue against answers we don’t agree with. Anyone in trouble needs to be put first - all of our ethical codes must agree with that.

Orion, this is a public board. As long as I don’t break the rules, I can post in any question I want. And this question is about believers attitude towards non-believers, so I think it is more than appropriate that I post my opinion.

I will challenge zealots every time I feel the need to. I will point out their hypocrisy and illogic. I find your brand of zealousness particularly distasteful due to the anti-science and anti-education nature of it, and also your bigotted attitude towards gays.

What is your reason for constantly preaching your beliefs? Or do you think only you have the right, and non-believers don’t? Or is that I bring up points you can’t challenge with facts, so you lash out and say I am just looking for an argument.

I am looking for a real discussion from a believer about the facts of your beliefs, not the dogma. Like the fact that everything in christianity and the new testatment has its origins in pagan religions. Everything from christs’s miracles, to the virgin birth, god becoming man, baptism, communion, all of it. Why is nothing in christianity original? Is it just coincidence. I asked this question the other day and the only believer to actually respond was flossheal.

These are real world questions that dogma can not answer. But believers don’t seem to be able to discuss religion without dogma.

You deny evolution, yet you say I look foolish. That is pretty funny…

I find it odd that unbeliever continue to come into Christian posts like this one, just to cause trouble; like jamahl does. Seems that they follow us around…Those ones try to start a fight, which is very wrong, inconsiderate, immature, and down right rude to say the least.

If you don’t believe in God why don’t you ignore the Christian posts? Instead of starting arguments, like this post for example…el ricardo asked a perfectly good question directed to Christians. It was meant to be a discussion, but some persistent non-believers come in just to start contention. Why? What’s your point? Do you do this out of meanness or are you the type of person who get a high out of causing trouble?

What ever your reason for causing trouble, why don’t you quit it…it makes you look foolish.

We see, as I’m sure others see as well, that your words are meaningless. That is the affect people get from trouble makers such as yourselves.

We as Christians are to share our faith with anyone willing to listen. The Holy Spirit of God opens the doors for us to speak. Many times it is the person who is searching that opens the issue anyways. Christians often make the mistake that we must throw all the bibles in the world at people in order that they might change their ways. How sad it is when this happens because it brings reproach on the name of God. We are, as scripture puts it, “to be ready to give an answer for why we believe and in whom we believe.” This statement leans towards the person having asked us, the Christian, why we believe not pounding them on the head with a 40lb bible. There is nothing wrong in being zealous for the faith but know where to draw the line. After all you are the only Jesus some will ever see. Let your words be few, your actions honest and upright, and care for others prominent. Let the love of Jesus shine through your actions and not your words only.

also to add to my question/observation…, we can all agree that we’ve given them so many chances, warned them so many times, that if they wanted to be christians they would’ve, but they need proof, and that’s something that they’re not going to get, so why continue to give us a bad image. I hope I’m not hurting anyone. doesn’t continual disproving, trying to turn others from God, and using Biblical scriptures to insult christians and disprove the Bible count as blasphemy against the name of God? and isn’t that the un forgivable sin? just wondering.

oh and jimahl, I wasn’t quoting to convert, I was quoting to show God wants christians to preach the gospel, but since you’ve all heard and refuse to believe why should we bother, well do I have to spell it out?has to do with hell. if you’re well versed you woulda known how the verse was being used.

“Have you ever noticed that Jesus was teaching everywhere he went. . He taught at any and every gathering, Like wise the Apostles Taught anytime they could And were not always welcome ( example Paul )”

No I never noticed that. AND NEITHER DID YOU! You weren’t there, and you don’t KNOW it actually happened.

“When we stop sharing and defending the Gospel because it is not believed by all we are giving up on someones soul.”

Maybe someone doesn’t want their soul to be given to a god who would banish someone to hell simply for not believing in him.

“Of course it is also a common since thing. . . Don’t waste your breath on someone who shows nothing but contempt, anger and hatered for the scripture. But remember anyone and everyone can read this, and what you say may help save a soul.”

It is not contempt, anger, or hatred of scripture. Why would someone feel that way over some ancient writings? It is the few narrow-minded zealots, who want to claim they are somehow more moral because they believe in the supernatural, that deserve the contempt.

El Ricardo, I did not mean that comment about quoting scriptures at you. You obviously think more logically than some othe christians. My wfie is a believer like you. She doesn’t think she is going to sway me or anyone else by constantly hitting them over the head with it. She accepts that either you beleive or you don’t, and quoting scripture at them will not change anyhting. But she also feels that belief in him is not required for my salvation. She knows the kind of person I am, and if in the end we are both standing there at the pearly gates, and god says no to me because I didn’t believe, she will be right there with me when we turn our backs on the cruel, vindictive SOB. If he lets me in, great.

Either way, I would have done the right thing.

Flossheal, I agree and it is a good suggestion, I am not sure how well it will be practiced though. I am definately guilty of not doing that. But I will try not to. But I am only human.

Amoeba, again excellent work.

lol, orion you can feel free to mark my answer as unhelpful but it does not change the truth of what you have said in the past… as amoeba has summed up your past comments quite nicely I wont bother…

There is a huge difference between a moderator and an advisor… as far as I know advisors arent required to be neutral in our opinions…

lol, orion are you kidding? you go into posts and condemn homosexuals and atheists, and now you’re having trouble taking what you dish out?

Jimhal has broken no rules and is free to comment where he wants, just as you are…

Oh come on Orion, you know you love arguing with us. Admit it.

Again, rnealw completely misses the point of the original question, and posts scripture. I noticed, I just take no notice of it.

okay, don’t completely stop preaching, but if someone’s heard it before you don’t have to. also… but we don’t have to rudely defend christianity, right.

Also to orion,

non christians have just as much of a right to go into a christian specified topic, which it origanlly was, but I’m glad it isn’t. I mean, we(christians)go into specifically nonchristian topics, even when they say, “ don’t tell me the “you’ll go to hell” speech, because I won’t listen”, yet, we do(I’ve done it before)so, they can post their opinions too.thanks 4 the comp amoeba.

ameoba,

anybody can look really bad when their quotes are taken out of context, even Jesus Christ…but go ahead and say whatever you want to because God knows my heart and He knows what you’ve done too…

ty, I didn’t think Fun Advice mods were supposed to side with members especially negative comments from those who like to cause trouble (like ameoba) .

We all know that you are not a Christian, but that gives you no right to stand against someone like you have here on this post.

I really think you need to take a step back and ask yourself if you really should be a mod…

* “doesn’t continual disproving, trying to turn others from God, and using Biblical scriptures to insult christians and disprove the Bible count as blasphemy against the name of God?”

If you read the passage that refers to “blasphemy of the holy spirit”, you’ll see that it refers to attributing the works of the Holy Spirit that Jesus performed to a demon. Not that it matters from my perspective, but trying to deconvert people, or using the Bible to insult them or to disprove itself, is not “blasphemey of the holy spirit”.

…although Jesus’ ‘blasphemy of the Holy Spirit” rant does seem kind of childish. “Oh yeah, well if you make fun of my mom my dad will kick your *!”

Have you ever noticed that Jesus was teaching everywhere he went. . He taught at any and every gathering, Like wise the Apostles Taught anytime they could And were not always welcome ( example Paul ) When we stop sharing and defending the Gospel because it is not believed by all we are giving up on someones soul. . Of course it is also a common since thing. . . Don’t waste your breath on someone who shows nothing but contempt, anger and hatered for the scripture. But remember anyone and everyone can read this, and what you say may help save a soul.

Excellent question el recardo…

Of course amblessed makes a post that completely ignores the question. What’s the matter amblessed, does this question make you uncomfortable? That he might be right that trying to inform the already informed is futile.

I think it is safe to say that most, if not all, atheists are well versed in biblical teachings, so it is not necessary to quote scripture in hopes you will convert someone. Not that I have any hope you will stop.

Jimahl, I don’t expect you to notice.

John 15:20 (New International Version) 20Remember the words I spoke to you: ‘No servant is greater than his master.’[a] If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also.

Psalm 119:156-158 (New International Version)

156 Your compassion is great, O LORD;

   preserve my life according to your laws. 

157 Many are the foes who persecute me,

   but I have not turned from your statutes. 

158 I look on the faithless with loathing,

   for they do not obey your word.

Opps there I go with those pro christian remarks again. .

now, el ricardo 777… I have no problem with anyone sharing their religious beliefs with me. I just have a problem when they think that their religion is the only “right” one…

and I think that, once again, flossheal gave an excellent answer… she represents what I think of when I think of someone following the teachings of christ. I also believe that you are on a good path. you show understanding when you “get” that the constant witnessing begins to be a huge turn off.. thanks.

sorry, I wasn’t trying to bash anyone, but it was something she said. sorry.

Zealousness is good, being a Zealot is not good. (A linguistic argument of definitions, but I think it matters.)

Having zeal for a good cause, and presenting it with care and love, must be good - we could be zealous for a number of things, such as recycling, care for the homeless etc, as well as for Christ. It shouldn’t be negative.

But what is labelled ‘being a Zealot’ is very unpleasant and means forcing ideas on people who aren’t interested in them, without care for the people or about how the ideas are presented. I would like to be considered zealous for a number of things, Christ above all. But I would hate to discover that I was behaving like a Zealot.

Jimahl - I was in a funmail conversation about problems like this the other day and my final conclusion is that if I seriously disagree with someone’s advice in a sensitive matter that it’s better to funmail that person rather than have the debate out in the open where it spoils the question. And if we feel the advice is truly dangerous or destructive, I think we can use the ‘report abuse’ button rather than wade in.

flossheal, you are definately not a zealot. You can discuss your beliefs and answer questions without getting defensive, and you don’t try to shove it down peoples throat.

okay orion… here is your ENTIRE quote regarding illegal aliens…

“What do you think our economy will be like in ten years with the huge influx of illegal aliens coming across our boarders? Did you know that a they can come across the boarders one day and the next be drawing OUR social security? True. Check it out by going to the Social Security Department.

They come to America and rape our economy by getting free housing, free food, free medical, free medication, free schooling, translators. They exploit our welfare system by signing up at as much as ten different agencies across our nation, lying about how many children, income…anything that will get them more of our money! Who do you think pays for all their ‘gifts’? America that’s who! thru our taxes!

If I sound a little angry, that’s because I am. I am seeing America is losing the battle. WE are becoming the minority!

WAKE UP AMERICA BEFORE IT’S TOO LATE! SHOOT, IT PROBABLY ALREADY IS…”

ORION, your words are EVEN WORSE when seen in their entirety…

“WE are becoming the minority!” who, exactly, is WE?
do you mean americans? or white people?

here is your ENTIRE quote regarding homosexuals… “Are you a Christian? If you are then you probably read the Bible? In there it talks about that lifestyle as an abomination unto the Lord…and ENORMOUS SIN. Here, let me put it up for you:

Romans 1:26-27, NIV. ‘Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.’ (Aids? )

Is practicing homosexuality a sin? It’s in the Bible, Leviticus 18:22, TLB. ‘Homosexuality is absolutely forbidden, for it is an enormous sin.’

You see, the Lord does not make sin and the homoseuxal lifestyle is an ‘enormous’ sin. It is a choice, they are not born that way, no matter what they say, they were not born that way, they’ve chosen to do it by choice, which goes against God.

Can a practicing homosexual go to heaven? I Corinthians 6:9, ‘Don’t you know that those doing such things have no share in the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who live immoral lives, who are idol worshippers, adulterers or homosexuals—will have no share in his kingdom.’

Practicing homosexuals are called to repent. I Timothy 1:10-11, ‘Yes, these laws are made to identify as sinners all who are immoral and impure: homosexuals, kidnappers, liars, and all others who do things that contradict the glorious Good News of our blessed God, whose messenger I am.’

If you have more questions please feel free to send me Fun Mail and I’ll do my best to answer them. God bless”

again, you ENTIRE quote does NOTHING to reduce the cruelty of your words… “Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.’ (Aids? )”

and your ENTIRE quote regarding the muslim faith… “maryam, no you are wrong; islm is not the right religion since it teaches death to who do not worship as they do. What kind of religion is that? I’ll tell ya, it’s Satan’s religion. Satan promotes hatred toward others.

There is only ONE God, the Creator, our Father! God teaches us to love one another and that also means OUR ENEMIES!

I’ll choose love over hatred any day of the week.”

the HATRED you are stating towards the muslim faith is even more obvious when taken completely IN context…

and as far as ty responding to my statement… I NEVER see you chastising rnealw for supporting a christian…

again… do unto others…

oh, here we go again… orion, the pot, calling the kettle black. unlike most christians on this site, you spew the most hate-filled rants against those that differ from your beliefs. Homosexuals seem to be your most recent target.

Here are a few choice quotes from orion -

‘’Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.’ (Aids? )’ ‘

“The reason Obama won’t wear the flag, refuses to stand for the ‘Pledge of Allegiance’, and turns his back on the flag is all for the same reason…he isn’t an American and he hates what America stands for!”

So, obama isn’t an american…

“I sure wouldn’t want Hitler running our country would you? Likewise, I wouldn’t want a Muslim running our country either.”

You equate Hitler with a muslim?

“BBB didn’t ya know that ‘science’ is sooo smart that they don’t need to know what you said or what you think, because they are always right, no matter what? LOL yea, think again!”

Quite the sarcastic christian, aren’t you…

“Bravo BB! Bravo!! I love it when the ‘good guys’ win”

Christians - good! Everyone else - bad!

“I can see that you are a very humble person who respects other people’s beliefs even though they may not be your own…NOT!”

Oops…your sarcasm is creeping out again.

“I do not like you and your disdain for others and their beliefs. Believe whatever you want even if it is wrong.”

Now there is that christian acceptance we hear so much about!

“maryam, no you are wrong; islm is not the right religion since it teaches death to who do not worship as they do. What kind of religion is that? I’ll tell ya, it’s Satan’s religion. Satan promotes hatred toward others. There is only ONE God”

Islam is SATAN’s religion…. Now that is some REAL respect towards others….

“The quran is false, not of God but teaches lies from Satan. Jesus Christ is the Son of God. He teaches us to love our enemies. Your god, allah teaches to kill your enemies, those who do not believe …”

Oops, back on the muslims again!

“jaceb, I feel sorry for you. You are a very angry person, and to be so young too. What a shame. It’s too bad you cannot spell. Now look who is foolish… You better make darn sure that if you are going to call someone ‘stupid’ then you’d better spell correctly and use proper English! LOL!”

I must point out that the quote above is from orion to jaceb and the quote below is from orion on the same question!
She can misspell, but will make fun of others if they misspell….

“I misspelled the word ‘live’ it should have been ‘life’ AND the word ‘inclured’ should have been includes. I’m in a bit of a hurry this morning…sorry. God bless.”

“For a very long time now, evil leaders of our world have been planning a One World Government (OWG), or a New World Order, (same thing) by turning us against each other with lies and deceit. It is part of their diabolical plan to get what they want. They are unfeeling, blood-thirsty, manipulators!”

Now, look up OWG and NOW…. The nasty jews and catholics are trying to take over…

These final quotes are the crème de la crème… They are from orion about illegal aliens…

“They come to America and rape our economy by getting free housing, free food, free medical, free medication, free schooling, translators. They exploit our welfare system by signing up at as much as ten different agencies across our nation, lying about how many children, income…anything that will get them more of our money! Who do you think pays for all their ‘gifts’? America that’s who! thru our taxes!”

“betta, spoken like a true illegal alien! Rude, ungrateful, proud, pompus…need I say more…”

NO, ORION - you need not say more…..your beautiful, respectful, loving words are quite enough to put us in our place.

reaches into bag of popcorn oh god this is great! lol