Do people who don't believe in god really go to hell

Start by responding to the points I’ve already made to your earlier pastes. Then I’ll read your latest article.

of course im willing to engage in discourse with you!look just for the last time read the article I sent fully and then I will never paste anymore but engage in full discourse with you there after! then after you have read it tell me what is your main objection into believing that god does not exist?

We are not god to decide who goes to heaven or hell! That is upto the supreme lord of the universe which is god to decide that! all we can do is find the truth and abide by what our lord wants us to do because he just wants the best for us in this life and the next!

puglover: You didn’t answer the question, though. Most humans who have lived since the time of christ haven’t heard of christianity. Are they all tortured for all eternity by your benevolent god for the sin of being born in the wrong place at the wrong time?

another thing…the Bible says that that the only way to the Father(God) is through the Son(Jesus) If someone doesn’t believe in God or Jesus, how can they be saved being that is the one who saves and who dwells in Heaven.

Good people dont make us Christians…the bible says “even the demons believe and shudder” so even JUST believing in God/Jesus doesn’t make you a Christian, its BELIEVING God and if we do that we follow Him and those who do not belong to HIM cannot be saved.

EXCUSE ME but Muslims DO believe in God…hello!!How misinformed ARE you people??!?!?!!?

I’m NOT here to debate or argue…so I won’t be back here “fighting” this issue…

…agreed…

“you ask for forgiveness at the pearly gates, and you get forgiven???”

Just asking for forgivness will not get you into heaven, you have to mean it.

im atheist… and I dont believe in hell …I doubt that if there is a hell you wood go there for your beliefs, everyone has the right to believe in whatever they want to

Like I DID answer, its NOT my place to judge, only God can do that, but maybe if you were to read the Bible for yourself, you may find some much needed answers. But being you are not a believer yourself, I doubt that you will, but there is always hope!

I ges not just blievin in sum god..but doig good is too a religion.. and it sure is gona take you up..thats what I think

Many Christians will disagree with you, but it doesn’t really matter. Your believes remain YOUR beliefs, and they don’t need to change unless you feel they should.

“I’ve been pretty much taught that people who are atheist and people who dont believe in god (like muslims and all that) go to hell”

ok atheists ARE people who dont believe in God to say atheists AND people who dont believe in God is mildly redundant… Muslims happen to actually believe in God… so either you dont pay attention, or the people teaching you these things are confused…

as for the rest of it, intolerance is one reason I cant stand religions…

surely they can’t, for in the bible it states that those who ask for forgiveness will be allowed into heaven…that’s why I don’t like christianity…what’s the point in being good all your life according to christiantiy if when you die, you ask for forgiveness at the pearly gates, and you get forgiven???

believe that you should be good becuase you are being a nice person and you care about others, not because you’re frightened that your gunna burn in hell for eternity!

sooitca makes a good point b good to help others and b a nice person not for fear that ull burn in hell

not really fair or christian if so

Still not an answer. What do you think happens to all those people?

bet you she cant

EXCUSE ME,BUT MUSLIMS BELIEVE IN GOD…ARE YOU ALL THAT IGNORANT???WE DO-HIS NAME IS ALLAH.

Is there anything for which Hell would be a just punishment? No matter what you do, you can only do so much of it while you’re alive. If you’re sent to Hell, you’re going to be punished for eternity.

No matter what way you look at it, Hell would be an infinite punishment for a finite crime. Therefore, by definition Hell would be infinitely unjust. It can’t mesh with the idea of a benevolent God.

Let us first begin by admitting that we are not gods nor do we possess all knowledge. It is also necessary to remove from our minds and hearts any prejudices and prior notions of how everything came into being and how it is being sustained and perpetuated. This is the critical first step to gaining any true knowledge and establishing facts based on proof. Ask anyone the question: “Do you believe in God?” and you are sure to receive a variety of answers. The question should be “What do you believe about God?”

Think about this: • If there is a creation, there must be a Creator. • If there is a Creator, He must be the Sustainer • The Creator Cannot Create Himself • If He is the sole Creator/Sustainer – He must be ONE

God must be one.Otherwise we would see great differences and competition between the gods if there were one – Alone. Do we agree that this is a creation? Or do we accept that nothing came out of nothing to form this entire universe? This is a very clear message from Allah, in the Quran. Something does not come out of nothing. So, there must be something in existence already which created all that we know to exist. And that “something” needs to be called upon in times of need and thanksgiving. As Allah has said in His Book: “I only created you all to worship Me Alone.” He also says that we are all being tested by Him with regard to our wealth, families, children and social status.

Scientists’ Comments on Scientific Miracles in the Quran:

The following are some comments of scientists1 on the scientific miracles in the Holy Quran. All of these comments have been taken from the videotape entitled This is the Truth.

1. Dr. T. V. N. Persaud is Professor of Anatomy, Professor of Pediatrics and Child Health, and Professor of Obstetrics, Gynecology, and Reproductive Sciences at the University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada. There, he was the Chairman of the Department of Anatomy for 16 years. He is well-known in his field. He is the author or editor of 22 textbooks and has published over 181 scientific papers. In 1991, he received the most distinguished award presented in the field of anatomy in Canada, the J.C.B. Grant Award from the Canadian Association of Anatomists. When he was asked about the scientific miracles in the Quran which he has researched, he stated the following: “The way it was explained to me is that Muhammad was a very ordinary man. He could not read, didn’t know [how] to write. In fact, he was an illiterate. And we’re talking about twelve [actually about fourteen] hundred years ago. You have someone illiterate making profound pronouncements and statements and that are amazingly accurate about scientific nature. And I personally can’t see how this could be a mere chance. There are too many accuracies and, like Dr. Moore, I have no difficulty in my mind that this is a divine inspiration or revelation which led him to these statements.”

Professor Persaud has included some Quranic verses and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad in some of his books. He has also presented these verses and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad at several conferences.

2. Dr. Joe Leigh Simpson is the Chairman of the Department of Obstetrics and Gynecology, Professor of Obstetrics and Gynecology, and Professor of Molecular and Human Genetics at the Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Texas, USA. Formerly, he was Professor of Ob-Gyn and the Chairman of the Department of Ob-Gyn at the University of Tennessee, Memphis, Tennessee, USA. He was also the President of the American Fertility Society. He has received many awards, including the Association of Professors of Obstetrics and Gynecology Public Recognition Award in 1992. Professor Simpson studied the following two sayings of the Prophet Muhammad :

{In every one of you, all components of your creation are collected together in your mother’s womb by forty days…}

{If forty-two nights have passed over the embryo, God sends an angel to it, who shapes it and creates its hearing, vision, skin, flesh, and bones…}

He studied these two sayings of the Prophet Muhammad extensively, noting that the first forty days constitute a clearly distinguishable stage of embryo-genesis. He was particularly impressed by the absolute precision and accuracy of those sayings of the Prophet Muhammad . Then, during one conference, he gave the following opinion:

“So that the two hadeeths (the sayings of the Prophet Muhammad ) that have been noted provide us with a specific time table for the main embryological development before forty days.Again, the point has been made, I think, repeatedly by other speakers this morning: these hadeeths could not have been obtained on the basis of the scientific knowledge that was available [at] the time of their writing . . . . It follows, I think, that not only there is no conflict between genetics and religion but, in fact, religion can guide science by adding revelation to some of the traditional scientific approaches, that there exist statements in the Quran shown centuries later to be valid, which support knowledge in the Quran having been derived from God.”

3. Dr. E. Marshall Johnson is Professor Emeritus of Anatomy and Developmental Biology at Thomas Jefferson University, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA. There, for 22 years he was Professor of Anatomy, the Chairman of the Department of Anatomy, and the Director of the Daniel Baugh Institute. He was also the President of the Teratology Society. He has authored more than 200 publications. In 1981, during the Seventh Medical Conference in Dammam, Saudi Arabia, Professor Johnson said in the presentation of his research paper:

“Summary: The Quran describes not only the development of external form, but emphasizes also the internal stages, the stages inside the embryo, of its creation and development, emphasizing major events recognized by contemporary science.”

Also he said: “As a scientist, I can only deal with things which I can specifically see. I can understand embryology and developmental biology. I can understand the words that are translated to me from the Quran. As I gave the example before, if I were to transpose myself into that era, knowing what I knew today and describing things, I could not describe the things which were described. I see no evidence for the fact to refute the concept that this individual, Muhammad, had to be developing this information from some place. So I see nothing here in conflict with the concept that divine intervention was involved in what he was able to write.”

4. Dr. William W. Hay is a well-known marine scientist. He is Professor of Geological Sciences at the University of Colorado, Boulder, Colorado, USA. He was formerly the Dean of the Rosenstiel School of Marine and Atmospheric Science at the University of Miami, Miami, Florida, USA. After a discussion with Professor Hay about the Quran’s mention of recently discovered facts on seas, he said:

“I find it very interesting that this sort of information is in the ancient scriptures of the Holy Quran, and I have no way of knowing where they would come from, but I think it is extremely interesting that they are there and that this work is going on to discover it, the meaning of some of the passages.” And when he was asked about the source of the Quran, he replied: “Well, I would think it must be the divine being.”

5. Dr. Gerald C. Goeringer is Course Director and Associate Professor of Medical Embryology at the Department of Cell Biology, School of Medicine, Georgetown University, Washington, DC, USA. During the Eighth Saudi Medical Conference in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, Professor Goeringer stated the following in the presentation of his research paper:

“In a relatively few aayahs (Quranic verses) is contained a rather comprehensive description of human development from the time of commingling of the gametes through organogenesis. No such distinct and complete record of human development, such as classification, terminology, and description, existed previously. In most, if not all, instances, this description antedates by many centuries the recording of the various stages of human embryonic and fetal development recorded in the traditional scientific literature.”

6. Dr. Yoshihide Kozai is Professor Emeritus at Tokyo University, Hongo, Tokyo, Japan, and was the Director of the National Astronomical Observatory, Mitaka, Tokyo, Japan. He said:

“I am very much impressed by finding true astronomical facts in [the] Quran, and for us the modern astronomers have been studying very small pieces of the universe. We’ve concentrated our efforts for understanding of [a] very small part. Because by using telescopes, we can see only very few parts [of] the sky without thinking [about the] whole universe. So, by reading [the] Quran and by answering to the questions, I think I can find my future way for investigation of the universe.”

7. Professor Tejatat Tejasen is the Chairman of the Department of Anatomy at Chiang Mai University, Chiang Mai, Thailand. Previously, he was the Dean of the Faculty of Medicine at the same university. During the Eighth Saudi Medical Conference in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, Professor Tejasen stood up and said:

“During the last three years, I became interested in the Quran . . . . From my study and what I have learned from this conference, I believe that everything that has been recorded in the Quran fourteen hundred years ago must be the truth, that can be proved by the scientific means. Since the Prophet Muhammad could neither read nor write, Muhammad must be a messenger who relayed this truth, which was revealed to him as an enlightenment by the one who is eligible [as the] creator. This creator must be God. Therefore, I think this is the time to say La ilaha illa Allah, there is no god to worship except Allah (God), Muhammadur rasoolu Allah, Muhammad is Messenger (Prophet) of Allah (God). Lastly, I must congratulate for the excellent and highly successful arrangement for this conference . . . . I have gained not only from the scientific point of view and religious point of view but also the great chance of meeting many well-known scientists and making many new friends among the participants. The most precious thing of all that I have gained by coming to this place is La ilaha illa Allah, Muhammadur rasoolu Allah, and to have become a Muslim.”

After all these examples we have seen about the scientific miracles in the Holy Quran and all these scientists’ comments on this, let us ask ourselves these questions: Could it be a coincidence that all this recently discovered scientific information from different fields was mentioned in the Quran, which was revealed fourteen centuries ago? Could this Quran have been authored by Muhammad or by any other human being? The only possible answer is that this Quran must be the literal word of God, revealed by Him.

CONGRATULATING AN ATHEIST

Normally, when I meet an atheist, the first thing I like to do is to congratulate him and say, “ My special congratulations to you”, because most of the people who believe in God are doing blind belief - he is a Christian, because his father is a Christian; he is a Hindu, because his father is a Hindu; the majority of the people in the world are blindly following the religion of their fathers. An atheist, on the other hand, even though he may belong to a religious family, uses his intellect to deny the existence of God; what ever concept or qualities of God he may have learnt in his religion may not seem to be logical to him.

My Muslim brothers may question me, “Zakir, why are you congratulating an atheist?” The reason that I am congratulating an atheist is because he agrees with the first part of the Shahada I.e. the Islamic Creed, ‘La ilaaha’ - meaning ‘there is no God’. So half my job is already done; now the only part left is ‘il lallah’ I.e. ‘BUT ALLAH’ which I shall do Insha Allah. With others (who are not atheists) I have to first remove from their minds the wrong concept of God they may have and then put the correct concept of one true God.

LOGICAL CONCEPT OF GOD

My first question to the atheist will be: “What is the definition of God?” For a person to say there is no God, he should know what is the meaning of God. If I hold a book and say that ‘this is a pen’, for the opposite person to say, ‘it is not a pen’, he should know what is the definition of a pen, even if he does not know nor is able to recognise or identify the object I am holding in my hand. For him to say this is not a pen, he should at least know what a pen means. Similarly for an atheist to say ‘there is no God’, he should at least know the concept of God. His concept of God would be derived from the surroundings in which he lives. The god that a large number of people worship has got human qualities - therefore he does not believe in such a god. Similarly a Muslim too does not and should not believe in such false gods.

If a non-Muslim believes that Islam is a merciless religion with something to do with terrorism; a religion which does not give rights to women; a religion which contradicts science; in his limited sense that non-Muslim is correct to reject such Islam. The problem is he has a wrong picture of Islam. Even I reject such a false picture of Islam, but at the same time, it becomes my duty as a Muslim to present the correct picture of Islam to that non-Muslim I.e. Islam is a merciful religion, it gives equal rights to the women, it is not incompatible with logic, reason and science; if I present the correct facts about Islam, that non-Muslim may Inshallah accept Islam.

Similarly the atheist rejects the false gods and the duty of every Muslim is to present the correct concept of God which he shall Insha Allah not refuse. (You may refer to my article, ‘Concept of God in Islam’, for more details)

QUR’AN AND MODERN SCIENCE

The methods of proving the existence of God with usage of the material provided in the ‘Concept of God in Islam’ to an atheist may satisfy some but not all. Many atheists demand a scientific proof for the existence of God. I agree that today is the age of science and technology. Let us use scientific knowledge to kill two birds with one stone, I.e. to prove the existence of God and simultaneously prove that the Qur’an is a revelation of God.

If a new object or a machine, which no one in the world has ever seen or heard of before, is shown to an atheist or any person and then a question is asked, “ Who is the first person who will be able to provide details of the mechanism of this unknown object? After little bit of thinking, he will reply, ‘the creator of that object.’ Some may say ‘the producer’ while others may say ‘the manufacturer.’ What ever answer the person gives, keep it in your mind, the answer will always be either the creator, the producer, the manufacturer or some what of the same meaning, I.e. the person who has made it or created it. Don’t grapple with words, whatever answer he gives, the meaning will be same, therefore accept it.

SCIENTIFIC FACTS MENTIONED IN THE QUR’AN: for details on this subject please refer to my book, ‘THE QUR’AN AND MODERN SCIENCE – COMPATIBLE OR INCOMPATIBLE?

THEORY OF PROBABILITY

In mathematics there is a theory known as ‘Theory of Probability’. If you have two options, out of which one is right, and one is wrong, the chances that you will chose the right one is half, I.e. one out of the two will be correct. You have 50% chances of being correct. Similarly if you toss a coin the chances that your guess will be correct is 50% (1 out of 2) I.e. 1/2. If you toss a coin the second time, the chances that you will be correct in the second toss is again 50% I.e. half. But the chances that you will be correct in both the tosses is half multiplied by half (1/2 x 1/2) which is equal to 1/4 I.e. 50% of 50% which is equal to 25%. If you toss a coin the third time, chances that you will be correct all three times is (1/2 x 1/2 x 1/2) that is 1/8 or 50% of 50% of 50% that is 12½%.

A dice has got six sides. If you throw a dice and guess any number between 1 to 6, the chances that your guess will be correct is 1/6. If you throw the dice the second time, the chances that your guess will be correct in both the throws is (1/6 x 1/6) which is equal to 1/36. If you throw the dice the third time, the chances that all your three guesses are correct is (1/6 x 1/6 x 1/6) is equal to 1/216 that is less than 0.5 %.

Let us apply this theory of probability to the Qur’an, and assume that a person has guessed all the information that is mentioned in the Qur’an which was unknown at that time. Let us discuss the probability of all the guesses being simultaneously correct.

At the time when the Qur’an was revealed, people thought the world was flat, there are several other options for the shape of the earth. It could be triangular, it could be quadrangular, pentagonal, hexagonal, heptagonal, octagonal, spherical, etc. Lets assume there are about 30 different options for the shape of the earth. The Qur’an rightly says it is spherical, if it was a guess the chances of the guess being correct is 1/30.

The light of the moon can be its own light or a reflected light. The Qur’an rightly says it is a reflected light. If it is a guess, the chances that it will be correct is 1/2 and the probability that both the guesses I.e the earth is spherical and the light of the moon is reflected light is 1/30 x 1/2 = 1/60.

Further, the Qur’an also mentions every living thing is made of water. Every living thing can be made up of either wood, stone, copper, aluminum, steel, silver, gold, oxygen, nitrogen, hydrogen, oil, water, cement, concrete, etc. The options are say about 10,000. The Qur’an rightly says that everything is made up of water. If it is a guess, the chances that it will be correct is 1/10,000 and the probability of all the three guesses I.e. the earth is spherical, light of moon is reflected light and everything is created from water being correct is 1/30 x 1/2 x 1/10,000 = 1/60,000 which is equal to about .0017%.

The Qur’an speaks about hundreds of things that were not known to men at the time of its revelation. Only in three options the result is .0017%. I leave it upto you, to work out the probability if all the hundreds of the unknown facts were guesses, the chances of all of them being correct guesses simultaneously and there being not a single wrong guess. It is beyond human capacity to make all correct guesses without a single mistake, which itself is sufficient to prove to a logical person that the origin of the Qur’an is Divine.

CREATOR IS THE AUTHOR OF THE QUR’AN

The only logical answer to the question as to who could have mentioned all these scientific facts 1400 years ago before they were discovered, is exactly the same answer initially given by the atheist or any person, to the question who will be the first person who will be able to tell the mechanism of the unknown object. It is the ‘CREATOR’, the producer, the Manufacturer of the whole universe and its contents. In the English language He is ‘God’, or more appropriate in the Arabic language, ‘ALLAH’.

QUR’AN IS A BOOK OF SIGNS AND NOT SCIENCE

Let me remind you that the Qur’an is not a book of Science, ‘S-C-I-E-N-C-E’ but a book of Signs ‘S-I-G-N-S’ I.e. a book of ayaats. The Qur’an contains more than 6,000 ayaats, I.e. ‘signs’, out of which more than a thousand speak about Science. I am not trying to prove that the Qur’an is the word of God using scientific knowledge as a yard stick because any yardstick is supposed to be more superior than what is being checked or verified. For us Muslims the Qur’an is the Furqan I.e. criteria to judge right from wrong and the ultimate yardstick which is more superior to scientific knowledge.

But for an educated man who is an atheist, scientific knowledge is the ultimate test which he believes in. We do know that science many a times takes ‘U’ turns, therefore I have restricted the examples only to scientific facts which have sufficient proof and evidence and not scientific theories based on assumptions. Using the ultimate yardstick of the atheist, I am trying to prove to him that the Qur’an is the word of God and it contains the scientific knowledge which is his yardstick which was discovered recently, while the Qur’an was revealed 1400 year ago. At the end of the discussion, we both come to the same conclusion that God though superior to science, is not incompatible with it.

SCIENCE IS ELIMINATING MODELS OF GOD BUT NOT GOD

Francis Bacon, the famous philosopher, has rightly said that a little knowledge of science makes man an atheist, but an in-depth study of science makes him a believer in God. Scientists today are eliminating models of God, but they are not eliminating God. If you translate this into Arabic, it is La illaha illal la, There is no god, (god with a small ‘g’ that is fake god) but God (with a capital ‘G’).

Surah Fussilat:

“Soon We will show them our signs in the (farthest) regions (of the earth), and in their own souls, until it becomes manifest to them that this is the Truth. Is it not enough that thy Lord doth witness all things?”

Even the Devil believes in God - but He refuses Salvation, freely offered (a gift, John 3 : 16) through Jesus Christ.

You call it pointless without even reading it? read it first and then give your opinion! Don’t be ignorant! be open minded dont read them with the thought that your going to disregard them no matter what and that I know better then that is just being arrogant! These posts are not for my benefit! What will I gain out of it? there for people like yourself to read and see logical sense! If there have already been scholarly writings in to what I want to put across then why not pasta them for others to read if it is relevant to the topic! Thank you for taking your time to read them! and im sorry if I offended you in anyway! Thank you

“Do you think we are created and are on this earth for no reason?”

I don’t think we’re ‘created’ at all. But yes, there’s no reason - why does there have to be?

“do you think that we are here to follow our desires and then rot and die?”

Actually, I think it’s up to us to define what’s meaningful and what’s acceptable, and follow those rules.

“The distance of the earth to the sun is so perfect for life that if it were a millionth of a centimetre further away or closer life could not exist on this earth! Is that coincidence?”

Actually, the earth’s distance to the sun varies by nearly 5 million kilometers over the period of a year - substantially more than ‘a millionth of a centimetre’. Further, the ‘habitable band’ within which life of the sort we’re familiar with could exist extends almost all the way between the orbits of mars and venus.

“The earth is tilted so perfectly that if it were tilted more or less it would not being able to support life! Is that coincidence? “

Again, the range of acceptable values is much bigger than you seem to think it is. While life would certainly be different with more or less pronounced seasons, there’s no reason to think it wouldn’t exist.

“A seed is as big as a grain of rice and it grows to a tree nearly as big as a sky scraper.”

So?

“A sperm is microscopic yet it grows into a human being.”

Actually, it’s the egg that grows into a human being - the sperm merely supplies half the genetic material.

“The existance of every organism from the beginning till now! how can all of this be possible without a force behind it causing the molecules to grow and expand?”

The molecules don’t grow and expand - we absorb more molecules through food and drink.

“Even scientist themselves believe that there is a force behind everything controlling and regulating things!”

No they don’t. While some scientists may believe that, that’s not a scientific proposition, and so is irrelevant to their professions as scientists.

“We call that force god! Now for someone to believe this force doesnt exist is truly ignorant! The proof of god is all around us and the proof of god is us humans!”

The ‘proof’ is all anecotal. The fact is, this universe looks pretty much exactly like it would if there were no designer - an interesting coincidence, no?”

Given that you lack even basic knowledge about the things that you assert are ‘proof’ of god, I’m not particularly convinced.

Do you think we are created and are on this earth for no reason? do you think that we are here to follow our desires and then rot and die? The distance of the earth to the sun is so perfect for life that if it were a millionth of a centimetre further away or closer life could not exist on this earth! Is that coincidence? The earth is tilted so perfectly that if it were tilted more or less it would not being able to support life! Is that coincidence? A seed is as big as a grain of rice and it grows to a tree nearly as big as a sky scraper. A sperm is microscopic yet it grows into a human being. The existance of every organism from the beginning till now! how can all of this be possible without a force behind it causing the molecules to grow and expand? Even scientist themselves believe that there is a force behind everything controlling and regulating things! We call that force god! Now for someone to believe this force doesnt exist is truly ignorant! The proof of god is all around us and the proof of god is us humans!

Allah says in the Quran:

He it is Who sends down water from the sky; from it you drink and from it {grows} the vegetation on which you send your cattle to pasture; With it He causes to grow for you the crops, the olives, the date-palms, the grapes, and every kind of fruit. Verily! In this is indeed an evident proof and a manifest sign for people who give thought.

Soorat An Nahl {16:10-11}

And He has affixed into the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you, and rivers and roads, that you may guide yourselves. And landmarks {signposts, etc. during the day} and by the stars {during the night}, they {mankind} guide themselves.] Soorat An Nahl {16:15-16}

And among His Signs is this, that He created you {Adam} from dust, and then [Hawwa {Eve} from Adam’s rib, and then his offspring from the semen, and], - behold you are human beings scattered!] Soorat Ar Ruum {30:20} [ And among His Signs is this, that He created for you wives from among yourselves, that you may find repose in them, and He has put between you affection and mercy. Verily, in that are indeed signs for a people who reflect.] Soorat Ar Ruum {30:21}

Verily! In the creation of the heavens and the earth, and in the alternation of night and day, and the ships which sail through the sea with that which is of use to mankind, and the water which Allaah sends down from the sky and makes the earth alive therewith after its death, and the moving {living} creatures of all kinds that He has scattered therein, and in the veering of winds and clouds which are held between the sky and the earth, are indeed aayaat {proofs, evidences, lessons, signs, revelation, etc.} for people of understanding

First you say:

“It is also necessary to remove from our minds and hearts any prejudices and prior notions of how everything came into being and how it is being sustained and perpetuated.”

Then you say:

“• If there is a creation, there must be a Creator. • If there is a Creator, He must be the Sustainer • The Creator Cannot Create Himself • If He is the sole Creator/Sustainer – He must be ONE”

Without presenting proof for any of these - we are supposed to just take them as fact? Why?

And then, of course:

“This is a very clear message from Allah, in the Quran”

Wait, weren’t we “remov[ing] from our hearts all prejudices and prior notions”? Where did the Quran come into it?

Arachnid, Obviously by you saying”your God” in your statement, you are not a Christian… Scripture says that “we are to go to All nations and teach the gospel of Christ..” and it also says that “The day of ignorance is no more…” that’s why as Christians we are to be teaching Christ any chance we have so that “no one may say that they have not heard the good new”…as it also says in scripture.. I am not here to start a debate…or to judge anyone, I am just responding to a question asked. Only God has the power to judge and He judges according to His word and what His word is, is truth so maybe you need to read the Bible yourself.

Wow what a question . AS A former missionary I should be quoting the bible with if you dont believe you go to hell. but I dont believe that anymore. there are many non christens that are good people who do a lot of good things in this world.

lets be honest are the people who are not christens or do not believe in any higher power different, evil? So say if you gave millions of dollars to organizations built schools helped the homeless and did not believe in God you’re going yo hell? To some maybe I cant help to look at people who dont know about Christen beliefs but are generally good. Guess what I am saying is that we all dont believe in the same things and we will never know what will happen in the future so live your life.

Only a Christian can answer this question. A Christians belief (if they truly understand their faith) is that we are all born into this world without the Spirit of God living in them. Christ’s (God’s son, God in the flesh) death brought forgiveness to all but not all are forgiven. The forgiveness if found in God’s Spirit. It’s like a diamond ring is in a box. If you believe the ring is inside the box, open it and reach inside to put it on, then you will always have this treasure. But it is only found in the box, nowhere else. So it is with God’s forgiveness. It is found in His Spirit. If you believe that Christ paid the full price for the things you’ve done wrong in this life and ask Him to live in you, God’s Spirit comes and lives in you and you will always enjoy His forgiveness which is found in His Spirit. This is the only way we get to heaven. This God’s only for you to even see heaven let alone enter it. So it’s not whether someone deserves to go to hell but if they choose to go to heaven the way God will allow. Who should be the deciding factor us or God.

wth was the point of that ambless?

I believe in reincarnation, & I’m also beginning to sway twards the belief of the summerlands, though I’m also kinda scientific so I’m not to sure about that part.

Most Christians believe that if you do not believe in their God then you go to hell, though God “loves you”(doesn’t make much sense to me). There are some Christians(though people claim & shout at them to their face that they’re not) that believe that if you don’t believe in God & are a really good persno you will be giving a secound chance on earth to redeem yourself. I have Muslims friends that believe that an angel sit on either of your solders, a good 1 & a bad 1, & each time you do a bad or good deed it’s written I ntheir books. Once your life is over, or if you become mentally ill, their books or shut & the desision is made whether you go to hell of heaven bast on the deeds you’ve done. If you done more good than bad you go to heaven, if you do more bad than good you go to hell.

No one knows for sure what happens in the after life, but since you believe in Heaven & Hell & do have a religion I would suggiest to you that you seek ansers in your own religion from other Christains.

hamza81: If your idea of discussion is pasting other peoples’ badly thought out screeds, it’s not much of a conversation, is it? Especially when you refuse to address the refutation of things you’ve posted earlier in favor of swamping people with ever more pointless nonsense.

The thief on the cross had never done anything good yet he did the one thing that could send him to Heaven - he accepted Jesus, the Way. Us Christians may not know much, but we know this: No matter where we are, no matter what we do, no matter how bleak or frightening our prospects, each and every one of us who believe, each and every day, lies in the same safe and impregnable place, in the hollow of God’s hand.”

puglover: So what about all those people - the majority of humans who have ever lived - who never heard of christianity in the first place? Doomed to eternal torment for the sin of being born in the wrong place at the wrong time? Not very benevolent of your god, is it?

Your god seems to be suffering from Santa syndrome - a fixation on whether or not people believe in him so great, that it’s all that really matters.

Santa syndrome is an ailment of many mythical beings.

I read the first couple you posted and gave my opinion on those (and refuted several of their arguments), which you promptly ignored and pasted more. What reason do I have to expect you’ll actually engage in any discourse over the validity of what you’re posting this time?

Good people are good people no matter is they are atheist, Christian, Buddhist, Islamic, etc. Bad people are bad people no matter if they are athest, Christian, Buddhist, Islamic, etc. Bad actions are bad actions and in my opinion, those are the people that deserve “hell”. However, I do not believe in heaven or hell. I think it is sick and pathetic that people need incentives to do good things or to refrain from doing bad things. People should do good things because they want to help other people, the environment, etc. and these people are real gems and the whole world should be filled with these people. Peace :)

works doesn get you into heaven, I know a lot of people that are good people who doesn believe in God, you go through the way, which Jesus Christ…the Bible says thats the only way…it isn hard to believe in him…atheist and whoever doesn really have an excuse not to except they just dont want to…we ALL deserve to go, even christians b/c we all come short of him…but christians are his children and we can go to him anytime and get forgiveness, they can do that to only if they’d just believe and sincerely ask…works doesn get NOBODY into heaven, but Christ’s blood does

I think the people who think they’re the only ones going to heaven have a need for a superiority complex, the result of someone earlier up the line being very insecure or hurt.

Yes, most christians believe that all non-believers go to hell. Many believe that applies to those who have never even heard of christianity (see the recent question on the subject). And as cthulhu points out, they believe that their ‘benevolent’ god then torments them for all eternity for the sin of not believing in something there’s no evidence for - or that they haven’t even heard of.

On the other hand, no atheist actually believes in hell, so telling us we’re going to hell is kind of pointless.

Only a Christian can answer this question

WRONG! Actually most Christians (you included) should NOT be answering this question.

There are plenty of good people in parts of the world where Christianity doesn’t exist, and never has. So what happens to those people? It’s not their fault they haven’t slept in a Motel 6, and found a gideon bible in the nightstand. So God sends them to hell too? For not believing in something they had no idea they were required to believe?

cough …loophole…